The Venus Cuckoldress Podcast
The Venus Cuckoldress Podcast
Faith to Femdom Cuckolding: How Scott and Whitney Found Their True Sexual Identity After Leaving the Church
Whitney and Scott share their remarkable journey from devout Mormonism to embracing cuckolding and kink. Their story reveals how open communication and mutual respect enabled them to discover and explore their true sexual desires despite starting from an extremely conservative religious background.
• Left the Mormon church together after 10 years of marriage, beginning their exploration of non-monogamy
• Accidentally attended their first swingers club
• Discovered Whitney enjoyed sex with others while Scott preferred watching
• Explored BDSM when Scott expressed interest in femdom, initially met with resistance
• Had a transformative experience when Whitney watched a man dominate Scott at a BDSM party
• Gradually developed their own style of cuckolding that incorporates elements of femdom
• Scott processes emotional challenges through extensive communication with Whitney
• The couple emphasizes that cuckolding enhances rather than replaces their fulfilling sex life together
• Now carefully select play partners who match their personalities and desires
• Share that a successful cuckolding relationship requires emotional work but offers tremendous rewards
Links:
Whitney and Scott's FL profile: LuckyMan82
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So here's what's coming up on the show.
Speaker 2:We went to a party and it was a BDSM party and there was this guy and he loved that this was our first time at a BDSM event. And he was like, do you want me to top your husband and show you what it's like? And I was like, yes, I would love that. And it was amazing. Scott crumbled under his whip and I saw the pleasure it gave him and I was all in. I was like, yep, I'll do this, because when it comes to the pleasure of my partner obviously my pleasure too, but the pleasure of my partner as well I am all in.
Speaker 1:This is the Venus Cuckoldress Podcast, a place to learn all things cuckolding For the curious, for the passionate and for the sexually empowered woman who wants it all. Let's go. Welcome to the show. I'm your host, venus. I have such a great episode for you today. Let's go. And then now they're a very kinky cuckolding couple. This story feels really special to me because I really feel like it showcases how, if you have a curious approach and an open mind, it really helps couples to understand each other and their deepest desires and be really compatible when it comes to those kinds of things. Whitney and Scott have also shared their FetLife profile, so if you would like to check it out, you can find that information in the show notes for today's episode. Right now I am doing a long distance move and for all of you who've done a move before, you know how much it fucking sucks. So I'm up to my eyeballs and boxes and shit, so it's a bit of a crazy time for me. I'm not doing a lot of the live chats in the Queens Quarters community right now, but I will be doing that as soon as I get everything all set up in my new location, so you can look forward to seeing some more live chats happening in the Queens Quarters community next month and you can always find all the details for that information about the days, the times and all that stuff and they are free chats as well in the events page on venuscuckoldresscom. Again, you can find the information for that in the show notes for today's episode. All right, that's it for announcements.
Speaker 1:Let's jump into the show right after this quick message from Joy Mode. My friends over at Joy Mode wanted a healthier, all-natural erectile support product, but they only had gas station pills and prescription drugs to choose from. So they started Joy Mode and partnered with best-in-class scientists and biochemistry PhDs to create their sexual performance booster. It relaxes your blood vessels and promotes stronger blood flow. Scientifically speaking, that means stronger erections and more stamina. Joy Mode is formulated by doctors and PhD scientists. It's recommended by urologists and made with clinically proven ingredients. Joy Mode is both an on-demand and daily supplement, so you can head into the bedroom with confidence. It's discreet grab-and-go packaging that helps you perform best when the occasion arises. Go to tryjoymodecom and get 20% off with the code VENUS at checkout. That's 20% off and free shipping with the code VENUS at tryjoymodecom. Joining me on the show? I have Whitney and Scott coming to share their really interesting story about how they evolved into a cuckolding relationship. I'm looking forward to this one. Welcome to the show. You guys Say hello to all the listeners. Hi everybody.
Speaker 3:This is Whitney. This is Scott. Thanks for having us on Venus.
Speaker 1:Yeah, thanks for coming. Okay, so when I first learned I've learned a little bit about your story and I was just like fucking fascinated, because I don't hear this very often where you guys are. You were a couple, you were in, like you were devout, what's called devout Mormons right, I'm not religious. I've never been religious, so I don't really know anything about religions but like. I'm pretty sure that that's like very conservative right, Correct?
Speaker 3:It is. It's like you've got like what would be like the, the like woke liberal Christians would be like the Protestants and like the crazy, crazy fundamentalists would be like Jehovah's witnesses. We're like. We're like a, an inch or two over from the Jehovah's Witnesses if these are names that mean anything to you as a non-religious person. So it's not like the super cultish level of religion, but it is a very, very conservative religion.
Speaker 1:Wow, okay, I've heard of it in the past. I've talked to some people in the past where, like, the wife came from a very religious background and so she struggled with you know, when he brought up cuckolding she struggled with it. So I've heard of that, but I haven't really it where, like, both people come from a very, very religious conservative background and then kind of explore this together.
Speaker 2:I don't I'm I've so many questions for you, so I'm so excited to talk about this we're excited to talk about it we joke that we won the lottery because we met and married within 10 months and then, 10 years later, left the church together at the same time and stayed married, and now we're happily living this lifestyle. This just blows my mind like this yeah, we celebrate 20 years this month.
Speaker 1:It is like you guys won the lottery the fact that you guys, you know, started out that way and and very conservative, and then decided to start questioning your faith. Was it one of you that brought it up and was like I don't know about this. Should we keep going down this road?
Speaker 3:Yeah, I mean, it's the cliche in this lifestyle, right, as the husband always brings up the cuckolding to the wife. Differently from the kink aspect, it was definitely me that brought up the faith aspects and had struggled for a while, probably for a couple of years. At the point I finally said something. Part of the problem and those listeners that come from conservative religions probably know this that it's pretty rare for a couple that meets in a culture like that and leaves faith behind to stay together. That's usually faith is like the anchoring glue right and once that's gone people realize like holy shit, we're like totally different people.
Speaker 3:I'm not even sure I like you and so you know, I mean, there was like a real struggle with even opening up about, you know, difficulties with faith, with this sort of recognition that like this could really send things off the rails. Right, there's a calculus of like do I choke it down, shut up and spend the rest of my life, mormon, you know, even if I'm not believing? Or do I rock the boat? Because if I rock the boat I could be ending my marriage.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and that was sort of the decision you had to walk into it with.
Speaker 1:And majority of people we know that have transitioned out of Mormonism. There's very, very few that remained married.
Speaker 2:I mean we're, we're a small number, Wow. So, whitney, were you kind of like shocked by this, or? Yeah for sure I was shocked and horrified, luckily for him, you know I joke like if you hear our our story of how we met and married like we were already a female led relationship during our courtship as well, and so I knew what I wanted when I chose him to marry. And then he he was a very submissive and loving and kind those first 10 years of marriage. So when he brought this up, I was like no, I'm all in on this marriage still, and I hate hypocrisy and lying so much that as soon as we started looking into the church it crumbled very fast and I did not blame him at all.
Speaker 1:Oh, wow, yeah.
Speaker 3:Dodged a bullet.
Speaker 1:Oh, I love this. I have a female-led relationship. I'm not giving up this man.
Speaker 2:Well, we didn't know that, Right right right, we didn't have that language at the time. But we look back and we're like, oh, we've always been this way, even as Mormons.
Speaker 3:We have a good friend that pointed this out a few years ago that we're close with and could be open about the lifestyle with, and she put it really like I've never forgotten it because I thought it was so great is she described it as we had been living this lifestyle before we had the vocabulary to describe the lifestyle we were living. And as we looked back, we're like, oh man, yeah, like, take the like sex kink out of it. I mean we from the day we met, really our first date was basically her telling me you should ask me out it. I mean we from the day we met really our first date was basically her telling me you should ask me out Right. I mean, just from from the get go. It was a very like turned on its head and in retrospect it was like oh yeah, we've been in a female led relationship for 20 years. We just didn't know that's what it was until I don't know seven years ago or something like that. Um, so yeah.
Speaker 1:Wow Okay, wow okay. So you, you guys, decided to ditch the mormon thing the church. Yeah, sorry, I'm so not religious I'm like the thing you know the world, like I don't know the, the church stuff, like, yeah, sorry my ignorance. Um, so you decided to move past that together. And then what was it like after that? How did you start talk, having discussions around? Well, more discussions around sexy stuff, kinky stuff, fantasies.
Speaker 2:We've always been really sexual. If we had to live apart from each other, like for school reasons or internships, we would write really sexy emails. Or maybe we couldn't masturbate because that wasn't allowed, but we would sort of have phone sex without touching ourselves. I don't know.
Speaker 3:So it was about as hot as it sounds.
Speaker 2:Hey, I was turned on. We just couldn't finish.
Speaker 1:You can't masturbate. So what do you do? Like, hump a pillow, like I don't know, like what do you do?
Speaker 2:You just masturbate, like what no.
Speaker 3:You cock block yourself repeatedly yeah, oh, wow. But yeah, this was even as devout Mormons, you definitely can't do that, but it sounded hot, so we're talking about it anyway.
Speaker 2:So we are people showed up in our fantasies.
Speaker 3:Definitely not allowed up in our fantasies, definitely not allowed. So we already kind of had this like banter of fun. Um of you know these possibilities and there were a handful of times where, like, we were daring enough to be like okay, like you know, if you could do like anything and like the religious rules didn't matter. And I remember being floored this was years before we left the church Like what would you do? And and uh, my wife Whitney, she's like, oh, I would probably have a one night stand with someone and I was like I'm sorry, you know what Sounded like the best thing ever to me.
Speaker 3:Um, so yeah, it was one of those things. When we left the church, we we started just kind of exploring ourselves. A couple of months later, we watched porn together for the first time. We'd never watched porn. That's highly frowned on in the Mormon religion and that sort of spawned this conversation of like hey, you know some of those fun things we used to fantasize or talk about. Uh, you know, like, if we really don't believe and aren't like handcuffed by this whole Mormon thing, like there's no.
Speaker 2:What if you know?
Speaker 3:like we could actually do that. I mean, that's kind of how it started. It was, I don't know four or five months later, before we like tiptoed into a club or something. But again, like we didn't know, like we didn't even know what the word cuckold was at this point, was, at this point, still right. This was like the edgiest we knew is like there are these really seedy, disgusting people that are married but have sex with people they're not married to right Like that was like the extent of our knowledge of this, like whole world out there, but it sounded hot right so like well, we could actually look at that.
Speaker 3:Is there anything around where we live? So that's kind of how it started.
Speaker 2:And honestly, we accidentally, we made a profile on one of the websites and accidentally said yes, we're coming. And then, you know, we were on Reddit, of course, trying to learn everything we could about how to do this, and it said once you RSVP, if you don't show, you're very rude. And we didn't want to be rude, so we went to the club the first time. Oh wow, rude. So we went to the club the first time, that's right.
Speaker 1:Oh wow, I was like, well, I mean, if we are svp you have to. Yeah, well, okay, so you, you kind of got pushed and not pushed into it, but you kind of got obligated to go me oh yeah, yeah, both of us to the club, yeah I mean you could, you could put it that way.
Speaker 3:I mean I were excited, like at the end of the day we could have on RSVP to not gone. So it was one of those like you know how sometimes you just need like the very, very minor, like yeah, go for it, and you're like, oh, okay, like fine, I think that's really what it was. Was this just like that? That last little mental hurdle that just became so much easier because we got the like email from the group that was hosting, like we're so excited to host you and we had read all the stuff in the forums and you know, uh, the like swinger subreddit that it's like poor etiquette to rsvp and not go. So it was like that last little yeah, that last little push of like okay, let's just go check it out.
Speaker 1:Yeah so how do you go from I still can't get over the fact that you're not allowed to masturbate like I'm like what? Oh my god. Um, how do you go from not being able to masturbate or watch porn to going to a swingers club like were you fucking terrified or what?
Speaker 2:we were nervous. I think we're really adventurous people in our life and and then it, you know, transitioned into our lifestyle life too. I'm also I'm extremely extroverted and love adventures probably even more so than him. So it just felt like this awesome adventure and I think we were in a very open mindset, exploratory moment in our life, exploratory moment in our life, and so it was just this fun thing for me at least. I turn nervous, scared energy into excited positivity, usually Wow.
Speaker 3:Yeah, it's almost weird. It's hard to explain, especially if you haven't been religious. I'm sure lots of listeners who have left conservative religions will will understand. But there's this, there's this sort of period of like rediscovering yourself sounds so like cliche and silly. I'm like struggling with the right words.
Speaker 3:But there's this, this period of like really taking a massive step back and, like most of us, you just kind of like you grow up in life and you're taught what you're taught by your parents and those are the morals you inherit and you may like dabble on the margins of like oh, my parents said don't drink alcohol, but I like drinking alcohol or whatever Most people don't like really do that like deep, deep thinking of like well, what is it that I actually fundamentally believe? And when you leave a religion like that, you're kind of forced to take this massive step back and just throw everything out and start over again in a way that I think a lot of people that again, even if, like on the margins, they move something, you know they change their morals a little bit from how they're grown up. I mean, we really just had to take this giant step back and down to literally what are we doing with our lives type of purpose discussions, that all went out the window. We had a very clear path and book written all about what this life is for. That all of a sudden, we didn't have anymore, and so I think that just kind of made us, together with our personalities, really open to like what's the worst that could happen.
Speaker 3:We go to this club and realize like everyone really is a demon with a tail growing out of it, and we just never go back Like, okay, let's go check it out, you know? Um, so yeah, it's just kind of how it worked for us to to be like and we've taken this all throughout the lifestyle that like people ask about well, have you really had bad experiences? And like they've had some experiences we wouldn't repeat. But by and large, we're just the types of people that are like, well, that was a fucking experience.
Speaker 2:Yeah, like move on yeah. So, yeah, definitely approached it from a learning perspective and a will. I like this. We didn't have a lot of rules going into everything. We just always made sure that we would talk about it afterwards and then maybe new rules would come up. But to this day we don't have a ton of rules.
Speaker 3:I can't, because we're learning. I mean, we didn't have mentors about what it's like to open your marriage, so it was like, oh shit, that made me uncomfortable. Let's talk about this, and maybe there was a new rule. And then a year later, it's like, oh, that rule is kind of dumb, we'd move beyond it. Yeah, yeah, it's just this constant ebb and flow that I'm sure everyone in this lifestyle is familiar with.
Speaker 2:And even though he hates it, I'm an over communicator and will force you to talk about everything and I'm like deeper, deeper.
Speaker 1:I love that. So how did it go at the swingers club?
Speaker 2:It was weird but freeing. This is going to sound horrible, but I mean it in the best way. There was this older woman there, very old, and she had ginormous breasts that I think hung to her waist and she was on the dance floor by herself just dancing, and I thought it was the most amazing thing I had ever seen in my life, because outside and in my family growing up and in my childhood, there's so much pressure to be perfect and look perfect and act a certain way and be proper and don't be provocative and don't turn anybody on. And here was this woman who owned everything about herself and was living her best life and that, to me, was perfection. So that was like the moment we walked into the club. So it was scary, but that was amazing.
Speaker 1:Oh, wow, I remember when I first jumped into the swingers world and same thing, on a journey of discovering non-monogamy and everything, basically my whole sex life. I was exploring it and it's funny because, like, the swingers clubs are that kind of like gateway, entryway, the door for people, because there's just, you know, almost every city has one right. So but I was, I had the same experience, whitney, where I walked into this community of people where they're so nonjudgmental, so welcoming and friendly and the women doesn't matter what the fuck you look like, you're just, you got curves, you're going to rock the curves, you got your. You know you don't have curves, you're going to rock it still, you're like. The confidence of these women was so inspiring to me I was like, oh, thank God, this is a safe space where you can just be you and explore yourself and not have to worry about, like you were saying, the standards of beauty that you're used to or whatever. That's amazing. So what was it like for you, scott?
Speaker 3:Yeah, it was like I don't even recall this woman, right? It's interesting how people take different memories from different things, especially in these first formative moments, like zero recollection of any of that. I recall how seedy and disgusting the club looked, and it was. It closed not long after our first experience by being condemned.
Speaker 3:I mean it was not the nice club to go to and down. We didn't know that. We learned quickly. You know I was very like on guard, right, like all of a sudden we're in this vulnerable place. I'm self-conscious about myself. You know, my wife is beautiful and everyone here is probably just out to steal my wife from me. You know. So a little bit of a more kind of tortured relationship, I think, probably with the experience. But it became hot really quickly. We didn't do anything with anyone else but we ended up having sex ourselves in this room, right Like in a club. That the idea six months prior to this that we would have had sex in a room full of people, like I would have told you you're out of your goddamn mind right.
Speaker 3:So it was. I mean, it was freeing from that element, because it was that first real experience in foray until, like you know, this is all okay, they're doing their thing over there, we're doing our thing over here, we don't have to participate with other people. We weren't there, we weren't ready yet.
Speaker 2:And for the record, when he says sex he means he fucked me for like 30 seconds.
Speaker 3:So in retrospect it's again, it's interesting, the things that stick with you and I'm like, without having the vocabulary and knowing what any of this was, and I'm like, without having the vocabulary and knowing what any of this was. The one like vividly distinct memory from that entire night is we end up in this room where there's lots of beds and there's people around having sex and whatever, and of course, because this is the way it goes, that we now know the bed that's right in front of the door is the last one to get filled, because no one wants to have sex right in front of the doorway.
Speaker 3:But we were committed when in Rome we are committed, the last one to get filled, because no one wants to have sex right in front of the doorway. But we were committed when in Rome we are committed. So we like do our thing and I go down on Whitney for a bit and whatever, and then we fuck and like we do our thing and this is normal. And then, like literally look up and there is a group of people that have congregated around the doorway and I'm like holy shit, there's like literally a dozen or more people that were here watching and we hop up off the bed and we're like getting our clothes on whatever and some unknown person that I never saw and have no idea. I just hear someone say, oh, you're finished already. And like again, I didn't know about cuckolding, I didn't know about humiliation fetishes, I didn't know about femdom, I didn't know about cuckolding, I didn't know about humiliation fetishes, I didn't know about femdom, I didn't know about any.
Speaker 3:At this point we're just like, hey, swinger world, let's like go have sex with other people, but it is literally the single most vivid memory of probably like any exploration in the lifestyle and it's it's. It's just, it's interesting to me looking back now how our kink and lifestyle have evolved and I've learned to embrace like these parts of myself and being turned on by these kinks and stuff that like oh yeah, of course that was the thing, cause there was this like it was a super hot moment, but then it was like humiliating in front of people and like other people would. I think someone even said like can I tap in? Or something like that. You know, there's like this whole thing, that's like so anyway, it was like again, without knowing and having any of the vocabulary for this, that like first experience with like oh, maybe there's something to this, like humiliation fetish, you know, sex with other people, thing that I just didn't know about.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's interesting that that stuck out, that that was the memory that really stuck for you and because it was a hot moment, right, it was a very sexy moment and everything like that. But then there, yeah, there was that little thing that somebody said that was probably a bit embarrassing or, you know, like you said, humiliating. Right but the combination between the sexy atmosphere and everything like your sexy wife and I just fucked, and everything like that, combined with that little bit of embarrassment, probably just hit the right switch.
Speaker 3:It's hard to put words to. Yeah, it really is. It's an interesting.
Speaker 2:We kept going back for more.
Speaker 3:Yeah, so it did not stop us yeah.
Speaker 1:So that's great, that you had a positive experience at the Swingers Club and I think that for a lot of people listening you'll be able to relate to this, where couples start in the swinging community with the expectation that you're both going to be sleeping with other people. But it's funny how often it happens where the husband is like actually I just like watching better.
Speaker 2:Yeah, they all wanted me. Eventually, right, when we went to more stuff, they all wanted me to play with their wives and I was like, ugh, I mean now I have some females I enjoy being with, but at the time I just wanted to get fucked, right. So yeah, that was the swingers world for sure.
Speaker 3:It seemed like there was definitely a heavy undercurrent of that and I realized it pretty quickly too. So, yeah, that was the swingers world of like, well, hey, what if the two of them played, and whatever. And I very quickly was like, oh, yeah, yeah, like even the three of you like do your thing, I would love to watch. And from the first time that happened I was like, literally if I never slept with another woman, like I don't care, like this is the hottest thing I've ever witnessed in my entire life. And and so it was like this kind of quick transition from like, hey, let's go open our marriage and like the two of us sleep with other couples or whatever, into you can sleep with other couples, or let's just start looking for single men.
Speaker 3:Because we also realized very quickly that it was difficult to find a couple that was comfortable playing with the woman, even though everyone wants a unicorn, if they know that there's a man involved, if they don't understand this lifestyle, because they just assume I'm going to be upset, or or she maybe is like, well, you're saying that, but like, am I going to be pressured into having that? Like it was just very difficult to find, I think, couples open and accepting to the fact of like. No, I really am just totally happy watching Um and that kind of moved us very quickly to like well, we don't have to find couples Like, we can just go find single men. Um, and you know, we did that for a while really until we learned what cuck cuckolding was and in fact I think, the first time we learned about the word cuckolding. It's sometimes perceived association with humiliation, which I don't know that it necessarily always has to be. We both were like Jesus Christ. Who's into that?
Speaker 1:Yeah, it sounds harsh, right yeah what is wrong with you people?
Speaker 2:It sort of implies cheating, which he has a cheating fantasy that I still have not done, because I just can't go have sex with someone without telling him.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:I just, I've tried, and then I always tell him beforehand yeah, so Well that's fair.
Speaker 1:That's fair. But yeah, it's funny when people just think, especially in the swingers world, they think of the world with the word cuckolding. They're like degrading, damaging, mean, unfair. Because in the swingers world it's all about a lot about. It has to be equal. Everybody's got to be comfortable. You've got to meet halfway. You've got to have the rules, boundaries, limits that everybody's comfortable with. It's got to be fair. It's got to be comfortable. You got to meet halfway. You got to have the rules, boundaries, limits that everybody's comfortable with. It's got to be fair. It's got to be everyone Keep everybody happy, kind of thing.
Speaker 3:Right and very hard to coordinate. It sounds easy. Yeah, it's very hard to get right with four people. We found Absolutely.
Speaker 1:That's why when I was in the swingers world, I want and I don't want to have to worry about all that other shit that I know is there for all the right reasons and everything just to keep everybody happy or whatever, but I was like I don't need that shit.
Speaker 3:Yeah, totally.
Speaker 1:I just want to go get fucked.
Speaker 3:You sound alike.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so was that right around the time that you guys learned about hot wifing? Did you learn about hot wifing first?
Speaker 2:So I think hot wifing was first and then, also for context, we have three young children at this time, so when we left the church they were all under the age of 10. So exhausting and anyway. So we're also navigating that right, like I was the one at the swingers clubs like, uh, it's time to fuck because I gotta go pay the babysitter yeah, yeah, you want to talk the other downside of swingers clubs.
Speaker 3:It's like why the fuck are you all waiting until one in the morning, like we're on the clock here? If you're not getting shit started by 10, 30 like this, ain't happening you know we're in our early 30s, talking like we're 70.
Speaker 2:So, yeah, so we learned about the hot wiping world and that sounded perfect and fun to me. And then, soon after that, we were talking and he was like, what would you think about Femdom? And I actually was angry. I was like you want to add another thing to my to-do list? Are you serious? I was trying to be an entrepreneur. Add another thing to my to-do list, like, are you serious? Like here, I was trying to be an entrepreneur at the time with something totally unrelated and then three small children who drove me crazy, and then you want me to dom you? Like really, I mean, yeah, so we got into that world.
Speaker 2:First, I think, I settled down. I was like, all right, show me what you mean. And I think that's probably why we're still married right Is because we understand that we have the best intentions for each other and that, um, that we're a safe space for each other. And so, you know, I calmed down a little bit and I was like show me what you mean. And so, I think you know we probably looked at a few things and then went to a party we're the type we just dive in and so I think we met a few people, went to dinner with a couple people, found a couple local femdom groups, and then I was like, okay, maybe we're already doing this a little bit. And so I was like maybe this isn't so hard, and I don't know that. Oh, you know what?
Speaker 2:We went to a party and it was a BDSM party. And there was this guy and he loves being a teacher. We saw him a few times afterwards and he loved that. This was our first time at a BDSM event. And he was like do you want me to top your husband and show you what it's like? And I was like, yes, I would love that. And it was amazing. Scott crumbled under his whip and I saw the pleasure it gave him and I was all in. I was like, yep, I'll do this, because when it comes to the pleasure of my partner obviously my pleasure too, but the pleasure of my partner as well I am all in. Oh my God.
Speaker 1:Scott, what was that like for you? Was that the first time that you had been really submissive like that?
Speaker 3:Certainly in a sexual aspect. I don't even know that we I'm trying to remember the timeline there I don't even know that we ever really like played with like a paddle or spanking or anything like, even anything like vanilla bdsm. We were, you know, just kind of talking about what does this look like and and what, what to explore. And it sort of happened by happenstance because that event was at that original swingers club we went to the first time. So it wasn't like you know they're in a lot of respects. I don't know what it's.
Speaker 3:I know that sometimes there's some variability geographically.
Speaker 3:Certainly where we're at there's a pretty marked difference usually between like the swinger, like sex kink world and the BDSM kink world, and they don't usually intermix all that.
Speaker 3:Right, yeah, so this happened to be one of the few events that was at a swingers club but had like lifestyle elements, to like BDSM lifestyle elements, which is why I think, like we still hadn't even fully discovered that there's like these public dungeon things and whatever that you can go do full BDSM play Um.
Speaker 3:So we were like we were very green, had really just been kind of talking about it, we didn't really go expecting to do that type of play Um, and he, he recognized in us and like we were literally about to get up and leave because we didn't know anyone, it felt weird. It wasn't like the normal swinger party we had been to and he saw it on our faces and read it immediately and was like hey, hey, come over here and like invited us into the group and like made us feel at ease and kind of the night evolved from there. So it was, we didn't go into it planned, it was definitely a transformative experience. Only because I'd never experienced that before and like getting to subspace and things like that, yeah, it was. It was pretty amazing, yeah.
Speaker 1:And Whitney did that give you the confidence to be like you know I could do this, like I could definitely feel comfortable doing this.
Speaker 2:Yes, I think, um, I think I also realized it wouldn't be a chore, right? Because at that time in my life there was just always so many things that were a chore. And when I saw that it would be fun and it would be sexual and it would be a release for both of us, I realized, okay, this sounds awesome. Let's let's try it out.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah. I have a friend who, uh, she started dating this guy. He's a cuck who really wanted to be dominated Like he, just he really wanted that. So he he, you know, know brought it up to her and she was like, okay, well, I'll give this a try. And she's like, she's like it was fucking exhausting, like it felt like a job, like it was just like I was working at it every day. I thought that sucks, like it's so, but I get what you're saying when you're like, oh, oh man, this is something else now I need to do, like another role I need to play. That would the thought of that would suck, but it sounds like that experience at the club for you guys was helpful.
Speaker 2:And I will say, yeah, for me it also as it evolved. I am a natural dom, it's just. I joke, I've never met someone who wouldn't submit to me whether that's in the regular world or not. That sounds so conceited, but I don't know, I just have a way of being. I guess that people just do what I say and so yeah, so as we played in the world, it just came naturally. So I did a whole year-long program learning all about being a dom and understanding myself and all the different implements and toys and ways of playing.
Speaker 1:So it was like a course that you did, or something we dove all in.
Speaker 3:Yeah, it's a program around the state here in a few of the big metro areas that they do. It's like a once monthly weekend long kind of mentors program.
Speaker 2:Oh wow, yeah, it was lots of hours.
Speaker 3:Yeah and uh, I, I think what it, what it did, is like everything that we've like learned has been like there's, there are these things people do, but you can like have balance in your life, and I think what we started to realize by then diving into this other world is like you can also meld these two worlds, like the the sexy kink world and the BDSM kink world.
Speaker 3:And it's not like the movies where like, hey, let's enter into a femdom relationship, so we're signing a contract in blood and I sleep in a dog kennel 365, right, like that is not what this is and I don't want anyone walking away from this episode thinking like holy shit, so she just beats him every like.
Speaker 3:No, this is like a, this is like a fun release, supplement to our, our sex life and help just realize that like you can grab all these little pieces to like build this healthy, vibrant, beautiful sex life together.
Speaker 3:And that's how, like, as we explored non-monogamy and like the open relationship and that transitioned into kind of the one-sidedness of it, then playing with this femdom and BDSM world, and then all of a sudden, we realized like femdom and BDSM world. And then all of a sudden, we realized like hey, there's this whole little unique way of that we could create our sex life where we're melding all of it and we can incorporate these like submission aspects as well as the open marriage aspects and like, oh shit, there's a word for that, it's called cuckolding at least in the way that we practice it and the way that we've now started to kind of explore and and you know, and like the prototypical, you know, chastity in terms of like chastity, cuckolding. That involves things like chastity play and and like humiliation play and things like that. But in this like again, not like you sleep in a kennel at the foot of the bed 365 days a year, but like, hey, occasionally we go do this fun, play, experience and incorporate other people.
Speaker 2:I don't know if that's a little bit rambling, but hopefully explaining myself somewhat well.
Speaker 1:Oh, I love that Shout out to the kink world man, They've got it figured out. The resources for people who want to learn about it, the opportunities for in-person events where you can go and meet other people, where a perfectly newbie couple can walk into an event and have somebody recognize oh, like they're new, like I'm going to help them out here, you know, let's like make them feel welcome.
Speaker 3:Well, and that that was the final piece of that story, transitioning in as we discovered the kink world. We learned about this mixer on the BDSM kink side of the world that some folks were hosting, called a hot wife cuckolding mixer. And you know we were like, well, we know this hot wifing thing, we're into that. I'm not so sure about this cuckolding thing, but we went to this mixer and became friends with a lot of people. We went a lot over the years and have done a lot with people we met there and that was kind of that final transition of like we tried this all in swinging. That wasn't 100% for us. We tried this all in BDSM thing. That wasn't a hundred percent for us. Oh, now we found it's this hot wife cuckolding kind of melding of the two.
Speaker 3:Um, and to to your point, like, yeah, that that that world, they've just figured a lot out in terms of making people feel seen and heard and welcome. Um, you know, like doesn't matter. To whitney's earlier point, it doesn't matter age body's earlier point, it doesn't matter age body type, you know, sexual orientation, like none of that matters, it's just very welcoming the support and resources and that's kind of how we found our way into this world and really I've kind of like this is this? Is it? If we go to a swingers club, it's because they're doing some sort of hot wifing, cuckolding something. If we go to a BDSM club, it's something about female-led relationship, hot wifing, cuckolding something. It kind of helped us find that niche.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think that the cuckolding world can learn a lot from how things are set up and available for people in the kink world and just all of the other things that go along in the kink world. Man, they've got to figure it out with consent, uh, consent, everything. Everything is centered around consent, like it's very much missing in the cuckolding lifestyle. As far as um, casual events and stuff go, it's very different, yeah, but, um, okay, so you decided to go down the BDSM route, the more kind of kinky route that I'm assuming that, scott, that means that you were kind of exploring more about the submissive humiliation teasing part.
Speaker 2:Exactly.
Speaker 1:I want to know what that was like for you because a few, a couple of months ago I had a guest on who talked about the dark side of cuckolding, where his he had his insecurities about himself, about his own sense of masculinity and what that should be for him, and even though he was very turned on by the humiliation aspect and the kind of teasing part of it, he found it damaging. And it was the first time I really learned the danger around that, like if you don't do this in a healthy way, if you don't explore this in a healthy way, it can be really damaging to a person. And so what was it like for you? Did you have to really kind of reconcile with your own insecurities in a way that was going to be helping your relationship instead of harming you?
Speaker 3:Yeah, definitely. I mean, up until this question, we've made this sound like a lot of lollipops and roses and just this fun exploration. There's a lot of work that went into this over the last decade or so and I still we talk about it all the time. I distinctly remember it was the second person that Whitney had ever been with without me like alone. Whitney had ever been with without me like alone, and I think the second time that she met this person, then I was present and I literally sat in like the famed cuckold chair for an hour and I legitimately thought I was watching, over the course of an hour, my marriage end before my parents. Really, it was that like emotionally, like holy shit, I'm never coming back from this. I'd never heard my wife sound like that. I've never seen her act like that in bed. I'd never seen her squirt like that Right, like all of these things where I'm like holy shit, like why, like I'm done Right, I literally thought I watched my marriage ending.
Speaker 2:He's always had that problem, though, Even before, like he's always just waiting for me to leave and I'm like dude, I'm still here. It's been 20 years. Come on, Give me some credit. Finally it's getting better.
Speaker 3:I'm getting there. But yeah, I mean, I think back to Whitney's earlier comment about, like you know it was tongue in cheek at the time about like being an over communicator, because she really is. I mean, she communicates a lot. She's the type that like, oh, something feels off in this friendship. Like come in, sit down and tell me what it is and let's talk this out. There's no like you know, whatever. Um, that's just her personality and so, um, which is good, because I'm the type that will retreat, like after a night or experience like that, I'm going to stop talking, I'm going to close up, I'm going to, like, work through things in my head, um, and that's that's had to happen. Uh, had to happen a lot because I've had to grapple a lot with those.
Speaker 3:You know she's already made some of the jokes on this episode about, you know, coming quickly and whatever, and there's a lot of views of self-image and masculinity wrapped up in the ability to last a long time, and this idea that there are a lot of men out there that may provide some aspect of sex for my wife that's better than I'll ever be able to is tough to grapple with. I mean, it took a really long time and I think part of that initial resistance to, like when I first learned what cuckolding was like you all are insane if you're like doing that, like this open marriage stuff is one thing, but like you're actually leaning into your wife going and having better sex with other people. Like, are you nuts into your wife going and having better sex with other people? Like, are you nuts? Um, and it took me a while to come around to the fact that, like me, wishing it wasn't true is never going to change anything, right, um, but it also doesn't mean anything about me as a person, right, if my biology is such that I come quick more quickly than some other guy. Um, like, that doesn't inherently mean anything different about me as a person or a human. It just means that I don't last as long fucking my wife and that guy lasts longer fucking my life.
Speaker 3:Like it's literally nothing more than that, um, and and when you can do that mental work of, of that type of comfort, it, it becomes fun, it becomes a joy of like you know, hey, I can make you sushi at home, but if we go to this five-star sushi restaurant with a trained sushi chef, it's going to be 10 times better, like, let's go to the fucking sushi restaurant and have sex with this bowl, because, like, you deserve that and that sounds amazing and we both get something out of it. Uh, but that was not. That was not that first night when I literally spent an hour thinking holy shit, this was it. I just, I just ruined everything.
Speaker 1:Wow, yeah, see, I get like. Over the last decade I've had a lot of conversations with cucks, cuck, wannabes, and this is a big question that they have that comes up all the time, over and over and over again. How will she not lose respect for me if I cannot be the one to provide her with what she needs sexually? How will she not lose respect for me? So, whitney, I keep telling these guys it's not how it fucking works. In fact, him giving you this gift of like, abundance of this, just makes you love them even more. And I keep saying this shit, but like they're not, they're still sitting there shitting their pants worrying about it. What do you think?
Speaker 2:They're thinking too shallow. I mean, respect is earned outside the bedroom, and then you want to spend time with someone in the bedroom because of sex. But also, there are a million things that build respect and sex is only one of them. And I'm not going to spend my life with someone just because they can fuck me for a long time. I'm going to spend my life with someone who can provide for me in every single other way, you know, emotionally, financially, intellectually. That's what I respect, and the sex is extra. And just because my cuck can't fuck me doesn't mean that he doesn't know how to please me. So that would be false as well.
Speaker 3:Yeah, that's the other thing. I see a lot and I know this kink is out there. I never try and kink shame people and if you're legitimately into it it's fine, but I think it's a lot of the keyboard warriors who are talking about the like. Yeah, I just want my wife to go like fuck other hung men and just like, never even touch me again and you know, whatever Like for us, like I don't know how that, how that works, because the way that that respect is retained is because, yeah, there are these things, there are these certain aspects that just I mean this is how it is.
Speaker 3:No, even the best bull in the world is, with the biggest dick that can last seven hours fucking like there's going to be other aspects that he's not as good at right Like just nobody's perfect at everything.
Speaker 3:Um, and and being as good and giving as you can be with what you're capable of and good at, and providing opportunities for the other things you aren't capable and good at Like that that's that's the perfect recipe, I think, for a fulfilling sex life.
Speaker 3:Um, and and sticking your head in the sand of like well, if we just pretend that I can fuck for 20 minutes, then I think for a fulfilling sex life, and sticking your head in the sand of like, well, if we just pretend that I can fuck for 20 minutes, then everything's right in the world isn't going to change the fact that you can't, so why not lean into what you're really good at? It was many embarrassing years into our marriage before I learned that like oh, you mean like most husbands don't go down on their wives for 30 or 45 minutes every time they have sex. Like that's just like what you do, like that's what got my wife off and I want to get my wife so like. And so to learn that people go down for the token three or four minutes, yeah, I'm just like wait, what I was horrified for my friends Absolutely horrified.
Speaker 3:But I lean into what I'm like. My wife has no shortage of orgasms at home without bulls, Right, Just because maybe my stamina isn't up to what some other bulls are, and then she can go have that aspect that that we don't have at home. You know that we can go do together or apart, but together the way we play our king, and so uh, yeah.
Speaker 2:One. One other thing I often think is like how much more a man you know I'm putting those in air quotes is my cuck than other men, because he is willing to admit his fault, he is willing to communicate with me and he's willing to put my needs above his own, whether those be sexual or other. So to me that's even more respectful, whether those be sexual or other.
Speaker 1:So to me that's even more respectful, absolutely. It's very selfless and it's about giving the gift of variety of experiences for you. Yeah, so you're not just I mean like I think that's fucking amazing. I've always said it cucks are like the best partners. I mean they're just amazing.
Speaker 3:Tell me more.
Speaker 1:Especially cucks, who are really good at eating pussy.
Speaker 2:Right, I mean that's their only option. Right, it's a lot of fun.
Speaker 3:I don't understand these guys. I'm like what do you mean?
Speaker 1:And, let's face it, most women what 80%, 90% of women require clit stimulation to have an orgasm. So, yes, piv sex is fun, getting dick down is great, but especially by a big dick and everything but like the like the getting your pussy after like fuck. Yes, yeah, sign me up there the like.
Speaker 3:Sometimes I feel a little bad when it happens with the bulls, but it's like the single greatest self-esteem builder in my entire marriage is when Whitney is with someone having a really great time but just like they're new, they don't know her body as well, and then can't quite get her over that hump and it's like the tap in of like hey Scott, like finger me and make me come a couple of times, because that really does once. It's I. It's a horrible joke, but I joked the other day when this happened that she's like. It's like like the Pringles of sex, right, like once you pop you can't stop right.
Speaker 3:The orgasms, but it was like yeah as soon as that first one happens, then, like, she is off for the hour, right, I mean orgasm after orgasm or whatever, and that like tap in of, like, hey, you know, finger me and put me over the edge. I'm like, yeah, stand aside, giant hung guy with an hour of stamina, and let me show you, you know, yeah, the, the secrets here. Um, you know, I think there's some respect in right, it's, it's, it's knowing your partner, it's being free to give, but also knowing them so well that like, yeah, you, you could tap in and 30 seconds later, that orgasm that the bull's been searching for for 20 minutes, you know, then sets off the rest of a fun encounter. That's a pretty big boost for a cuck, I think.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, absolutely. And you know, I feel like it's just cuck holding is just adding. It's adding more excitement and opportunity to your already fulfilled sex life. I mean, yeah, you might not be able to last long as some other dude, but, like you were saying, that's just one part of sex, that is not the be-all end-all. But so many cucks get so focused on size and endurance being the be-all end-all because maybe it's the typical porn scripts that you see in porn, where it is that that's the magic ingredient the size and how long he can last for, and then she's coming, you know, like so fake.
Speaker 2:She's squealing away, and maybe that's one reason we're different is we didn't watch a ton of porn growing up. He did watch some he was a bad little Mormon but I didn't watch any. I mean, I saw a couple things but I was like, ah, turn it off. So we just went into this not knowing what it should look like.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you know, that's probably it, and I've heard a lot of uh podcasts talking about um flipping the script when it comes to sex instead of it being the usual script in porn, and creating a script that works for you and that you want to, or if you want to switch it up or whatever, and doing that instead and it being way more fulfilling than just expecting the usual script of it starts with this and then that goes to that and that and thinking that that's like the secret recipe. So for all the cucks listening, I'm telling you right now is not the secret recipe? Something like 90 of women do not have an orgasm. Hetero women do not have an orgasm with a one night stand random guy on the first time. Yeah, like it's just they don't you do, and it's because we follow the same usual scripts, right, when it comes to cuckolding. You can build whatever script you want, including a cuck who eats pussy like a champ.
Speaker 2:It better be that way. That's part of it and it's funny.
Speaker 3:it's funny you say that and I'm sure someday this will change. But like 10 years into opening our marriage, there's never been another partner that has made her orgasm from oral Cause it really does take a long time.
Speaker 3:But every time we tell that to a new perspective bull, it's the bravado like oh well, that's just because you haven't met me, like we'll change that, and sure as shit. They go to get together for their first time and he goes down and does a respectable job for four or six minutes and then it's, you know, it's like, well, here, here we go again. But it, I mean it, yeah, it's, it's true to your. Your point it's, uh, you know, figuring out what works. Uh, it takes time, it takes knowing someone, it takes knowing a body. And yeah, getting that from a one-night stand is just impractical.
Speaker 1:You know it's so funny, my whole life I had the four to five-minute pussy eating thing. My whole life until I was in my early 30s. Then I met this random guy who loved to eat pussy. I mean like you know the kind, like love, like lives for it, you know, Yep and he took a sweet ass time and he was down there for 3040 minutes and that was the first time I actually had an orgasm from oral and I was like, oh, this is the best fucking thing.
Speaker 1:I have ever had in my life, like holy fucking shit. And after that I was like, okay, that's it, I'm just going to lay back, I'm going to put on a fucking movie. You get your face between my legs and you just stay down there?
Speaker 2:We do that sometimes. If I'm too in my head or whatever I'm like, I'll turn on a movie.
Speaker 3:She thought it was a little weird. The first time I suggested I was like why don't you put on?
Speaker 2:your show and just I'll spend an episode and like what that's weird, that seems rude, right, right.
Speaker 3:But we're like being anxious and in her head it would have taken 30 or 40 minutes. You know, like 12 minutes later the TV's off and it's like okay, let's get like, okay, that worked. And I'm just, I'm telling you guys, if you're listening to me and you've never been down for more than five minutes, like knock that shit off.
Speaker 1:Yeah, absolutely.
Speaker 3:Just go especially.
Speaker 1:Yeah and yeah, just go slow and rhythmic and lick the drips off the ice cream cone and you will get there eventually, but yeah, okay, um. So what's what's cuckolding like for you guys now? What does it look like for you now? Because this has been quite the journey that has evolved.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so I hate being online. So Scott runs our accounts and we have curated our profiles to be very specific and so it is easy for people to be weeded out. So he manages all of the incoming messages and he's really good at picking guys that I will like. So it's, I've become pickier with age, I think last 10 years I just I slept with a lot of people and it was a lot of fun, and now I'm getting a little pickier and he's working with that, but it does mean less play. But, yeah, so usually he'll pick a guy.
Speaker 2:You know we'll go meet them. They are into this world already, right? They're asking to be part of a cuckold relationship, and if we hit it off during breakfast or lunch or whatever we go to, um, then we'll typically meet them a different time. It's rare We'll meet the like, go to the bedroom the same day, um, often at a hotel, just because and um, yeah, so we all go and get the job done. That's a way to put it. We've had some more intricate scenes with people who are more advanced. I would say, like we had a friend once video for us and that helped open his eyes to how amazing cuckolding can be. And then yeah, so Scott's played a few different ways, like we've had bowls who are open to him sucking dick, because I love watching that, and then others are not. He has had to be in the other room on work calls sometimes. Yeah, so that was fun.
Speaker 3:That is. It was fun for me, hot and disconcerting at the same time. Let me tell you oh, mute, quick, quick, quick. She's getting loud.
Speaker 2:He'll fold our clothing, maybe towards the end I'll send him out to. One time I made him go make us lunch because we were at it for a couple of hours and I was famished. I'm like go get me some lunch and the bowl too. Of hours and I was famished, I'm like go get me some lunch and the bowl too. So it looks a lot of different ways. I would say it ebbs and flows and changes depending on how busy we are in our regular life.
Speaker 3:I think we're so personality driven and the people we want to invite in our sex life at this point that we will joke sometimes that we're kind of chameleons. We'll, we'll adapt to the situation. So, if someone's like really into the like heavy cuckolding, like humiliation, like teasing, play, like sign me up, I'm all about it. If someone's like you know, yeah, maybe just like don't really say anything, I'm kind of new to this and like it makes me nervous, like I'll hang out and watch, right, uh, yeah, we're, we're kind of open to whatever um, which, uh, which makes it easy to focus much more on is this person the right fit, and where we are in our lives now and how busy we are. If we're going to invite someone into our relationship, we just want to have a really good time. We don't have to want to work that hard at it. So we're, I think we're a lot more open. Like if we have two or three different play partners going at a time, like the play will look different with all three of them. Right, yeah, for him.
Speaker 3:You know, uh, whitney's on on Bumble and occasionally we'll find dates on Bumble. Like she's had a few guys that she's seen several times that I've just never met. It's been just completely independent, like that's cool. Other guys, like I said, where I'll watch, or we'll be much more involved. So we're just kind of open to if you're the right personality and fit for what we want in our relationship, what are you into, and let's explore it. You know, which is a lot of fun.
Speaker 1:We're pretty much out of time at this point, which sucks because I feel like we have so much more to talk about, but that's OK. What do you before I wrap this up, what do you? What are you guys hoping that people will take away from this episode? That's important to you.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I think, from my perspective and kind of where, where I'm at in the lifestyle probably talking more to the cucks or cuck wannabes and I don't mean that in like a degrading sense, but like people who are interested in this lifestyle but haven't quite taken or had the opportunity to take the step is it can be emotionally taxing but also so worth it. And I think a lot of times we get caught up in if this experience isn't amazing then it's bad, and I think that probably frightens a lot of people off from trying to explore this lifestyle. Because the reality I think the takeaway from me is the reality is you will have difficult moments and you'll have bad experiences. And you'll have bad experiences and you'll have tough emotional and mental challenges to grapple with and work through. But the flip side of that, the reward of it, is just so overwhelmingly positive that it's worth that work because it's added such incredible dimensions to our relationship, not just sexual, the way we communicate, the way we parent, the way we friend with friend, like. So much of it is informed by how we've explored this lifestyle.
Speaker 3:Um, that like, don't let those like, but what if like? Is your wife going to lose respect for you? Like no, uh, but like, also, you have to talk to your wife. Like, why are you posting on Reddit about how your wife's going to feel? Go talk to your wife. So I think that would be my single biggest takeaway is like don't let the fear of the difficult moments that are 100% going to come if you don't jump into this lifestyle from the cuckold perspective and certainly from the cuckold perspective too, because you know I don't want to put words in your mouth, but I think Whitney would say that when I've had a bad experience or reacted poorly, that's taken just as much of a mental toll on her because we're in love, right. If you find your wife being like, oh sorry, you're having a difficult time, dick, like leave me alone, you probably need to take a step back and have a tough conversation, right. Like it just naturally is emotionally taxing on her as much as it is me. So don't let that scare you.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I guess mine was going to be similarly veined, in that it is one piece of your life and it will become. You know, cuckolding and kinky stuff and sexual stuff becomes better when you're putting effort in there and when you're putting effort in everywhere, right? So, as a complete person, and that includes that open communication, whether you need to go see a therapist or you need to journal If you want to have this kind of a lifestyle. It's a heavy lifestyle, right, it is complicated and amazing and beautiful. Just like he said, I would not change it for the world, but you've got to do a lot of work to make sure you're the kind of person that will be a good partner, right? So, like, especially as the woman, as the cuckoldress, I have a lot of power and I I'm not going to quote, uh, whatever, that is, lord of the Rings or something- but anyway with great power.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so, but I am going to say that that is true, like you need to be the kind of woman that deserves that power, and you need to be aware of yourself and how you're treating your cuck and how you're making sure their needs are met as well.
Speaker 1:Yes, absolutely, it's a big responsibility. It is, yeah, all right. Well, I do have your FetLife profiles that I can share in the description notes for today. So if anyone listening wants to reach out, you can find them there. Just have a look in the description notes for today. So if anyone listening wants to reach out, you can find them there. Just have a look in the show notes. Whitney and Scott, thank you so much for coming on the show today. I have thoroughly enjoyed this conversation. This has been great.
Speaker 3:So thank you. You never want to be the boring podcast.
Speaker 1:No, it's been fun, so thank you so much. Yeah, thanks for having us on All right?
Speaker 3:No, it's been fun, so thank you so much yeah.
Speaker 1:Thanks for having us on. That's going to be it for today's episode. Thank you so much for joining me. Make sure you go to venuscuckoldresscom. That's where you can book a private chat with me and you can also join the Queens Quarters community and get all the amazing benefits like the private podcast and the helpful cuck tier, where you can get amazing benefits like the private podcast and the helpful Cuck tier, where you can get key holding for the private Snapchat group, monthly private chats with me and weekly live hangouts and invites to special live events. Oh, and you can also submit a question or confession for the show. Just go to venuscuckledresscom and click on the link that says the podcast. Make sure you follow me on Blue Sky Social. Yes, I said Blue Sky Social. Fuck Twitter. My handle there is at Cuckoldress V. All right, that's it for today's show. You guys, we'll see you next time.